[Group effort!] Let's build a character guide.

Discussion in 'Units & Items' started by Raijinili, Apr 17, 2015.

  1. Raijinili

    Raijinili Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    342
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2014
    Medals:
    Lots of the same questions over and over, with lots of the same answers.

    So, uh. how should this be done? Do we just, like, list all the units? Should we try to design and build a tool for tbs.desile.fr (a filter on units that auto-classifies units)?

    Besides character-by-character analysis, there should also be a section on putting together a team (for story mode). That's more soft analysis, so I hope other people can work on that.

    The "train" category should be broken down into "currently useful (for battle X)" and "will probably be useful (for expected battle type Y)".
     
    conndubya likes this.
  2. Dr. Class

    Dr. Class Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    761
    Likes Received:
    929
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2015
    Medals:
    I like the idea.

    Possibly go into detail the usefulness (or uselessness) of every character; what they do and who they're strictly better then.
    Maybe even a list of certain arch-types of squads, and which work best for certain battles.

    I will try to provide as much insight and experience as I can, if needed.
     
  3. Raijinili

    Raijinili Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    342
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2014
    Medals:
    Who is the greatest character?
     
  4. Tealius

    Tealius The Magic Mint Mod

    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    425
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2014
    Honestly I think this is just added work. With the dynamic of the game, a character guide is simply too difficult and will be too convoluted to construct and read. However, I think a 'Comprehensive Dungeon Guide' might be better, but that's basically a collection of all the guides here so far. It's hard to compare characters when there are so many different cases where x and y could vary in usefulness. Yes there are good general characters, and yes there are specific niche characters, but there are plenty who vary in usefulness. It'd be too hard to do, unless you simply put a ranking of 5 stars next to each character for a specific dungeon, which might work.
     
  5. J692

    J692 Active Member

    Messages:
    162
    Likes Received:
    107
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2015
    I honestly don't think there is a single greatest character, since every character has a weakness. The SS mages are great for early game story clearing as well as for farming, but the magic def. of most characters in the later chapters are so high that it makes them hit for very little. Gugba is another character that makes farming a breeze, but, like the SS mages, lacks enough AoE damage to kill anything by himself at higher chapters. The DPS holy trinity (Bahl, S'naip, and Ma'curi) do ridiculous damage and make taking down bosses a piece of cake, but lack the survivability that characters like the SS mages and Gugba have. The twins are great for helping to clear PoF (which is a long and hard journey), but their lack of damage prevents them from being too useful outside of that. ect, ect. As we can see, every character, while great in one way or another, has flaws that prevent them from being op (and that's good balancing on MW's part). So, in all honesty, there isn't one character that can serve every single need. That's why there's a diversity of characters in Terra Battle to help provide the niche roles that need to be fulfilled.
     
    Unspoken and xAobax like this.
  6. stomach ache

    stomach ache Active Member

    Messages:
    294
    Likes Received:
    133
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2014
    We should also have a reccomended set of skills for each job so it'll be easier to maximize the potential for the adventurer.
     
    Raijinili likes this.
  7. Raijinili

    Raijinili Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    342
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2014
    Medals:
    Wrong. The greatest character is GegonaGod.

    Not really ratings so much as categorization.

    Here's an example of what I do:
    http://terrabattleforum.com/threads/my-spoon.7469/#post-62433
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2015
    Dr. Class likes this.
  8. Dr. Class

    Dr. Class Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    761
    Likes Received:
    929
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2015
    Medals:
    Was going to go into detail about how to define character usefulness, and how to determine the greatest character overall - then say it was Gegonago(d) anyway.
    Due to a poorly timed dead battery (from constant Skill Boosting in fact) I was unable to complete said action.

    I am glad it was still made clear Gego is the best.
     
  9. Yuki Judai

    Yuki Judai Active Member

    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    127
    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    they already have those at a chinese site. I can translate it and everyone can revise it to fit the current meta if they want
     
  10. FishInTheDark

    FishInTheDark Forum Event Manager Staff Member

    Messages:
    858
    Likes Received:
    536
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2015
    What's the chinese site?
     
  11. Yuki Judai

    Yuki Judai Active Member

    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    127
    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    FishInTheDark likes this.
  12. FishInTheDark

    FishInTheDark Forum Event Manager Staff Member

    Messages:
    858
    Likes Received:
    536
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2015
    Thanks! Always good to have more resources. Especially since this site is starting to impose more rules.
     
  13. Tealius

    Tealius The Magic Mint Mod

    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    425
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2014
    Here is more of what I was talking about:
    AmazoraB Class - Fire/Sword (J 1/2/3)
    Main Story★★★☆☆
    Bahamut (Single Player)★☆☆☆☆
    Leviathan (Single Player)★★★☆☆
    Odin (Single Player)★☆☆☆☆
    Artemis (Co-Op)★☆☆☆☆
    Chaos (Co-op)★☆☆☆☆
    Valkyrie (Co-op)★☆☆☆☆
    Lamia (Co-op)★☆☆☆☆
    Overall★★☆☆☆
    Maybe add a short blurb here and there about why x and y and z but not alpha or omega blah blah. This way, it's more of an easy TL;DR of each character with it's usefulness (out of 5 stars or something).
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2015
    Pandemon, Todd, smother and 3 others like this.
  14. HunterScarX

    HunterScarX Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    5
    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2014
    This is really good and easy to understand! I don't think it's worth the time to put together though.
     
  15. Raijinili

    Raijinili Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    342
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2014
    Medals:
    I'm not looking for character ratings. I'm looking more for character classification: Use (main story), Train (specialist and utility), Optional (no real niche and not that strong), Ignore (weak and no niche). This kind of thing won't be as easily affected by new events (and yes, it will still be affected by new events, I know).

    For Train, yes, there can be ratings on how useful it is if it's given a niche. For the breakdown by niche, rather than rate every single unit, how about a section for each event listing the most desirable characters? But the thing is, it's kind of pointless for Kuscah to be listed at all, since the main goal of the guide should be, "Who should I prioritize in training?" and Kuscah/Sorman is high priority.

    For classification by event, I think this is close to complete:
    - Strong: Units that you want a lot of. Capsules, strong attackers, Circle augmenters in the right battle.
    - High utility (limited): Units you really want at least one of, but you don't need many. Remedy and Healer. Maybe Korin.
    - Mediocre: Attackers that aren't very offensive (e.g. Upi) or without some utility. Utility that's not very necessary (??).
    - Mediocre utility (limited): Specific Remedy and Damage units in Lamia? (Maybe this is best left to specific guides.)
    - Weak attacker: Filler. Sh'berdan and other mixed attackers.
    - Weak utility: Don't know of any. Don't think there are any.
    - Undesirable: "Can't you bring something else?"
     
  16. Tealius

    Tealius The Magic Mint Mod

    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    425
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2014
    Don't the characters skills/stats speak for themselves? Like, it'd be much easier asking 'Who is good for X' as opposed to "What is X good for." And the guides do that. For story mode, since it isn't overly difficult, it is possible to complete it with many combinations of characters, and it's easy to tell who to have for what level based on the info each level gives you before you enter. In general, it's good to level one of every weapon, every element, a healer, and a panacea. If you don't have access to every weapon or element, it's not the end of the world. The tiers you plan to propose are either already in place (Class ranking) or up to player opinon. What exactly are you trying to accomplish in a 'comprehensive character guide' that won't make it convoluted or too long?
     
    HunterScarX likes this.
  17. Tealius

    Tealius The Magic Mint Mod

    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    425
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2014
    That can change depending on what you need. For example, I'd take Anti Fire Capsules and Shield on A'merpact over MAtk+10% and another offensive spell on a fire level, but there are so many combinations that it's hard to say what is the 'maximum potential' since there are so many different needs. It'd become a little clustered, since certain skills are better than others (The outflank skill usually sucks except in Valkyrie, where is it super useful)
     
    stomach ache likes this.
  18. Raijinili

    Raijinili Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    342
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2014
    Medals:
    It should answer, for a new player, "Who should I use?" and "Who should I train?" (Does not answer rerolling.)

    You're talking about stats and skills being enough. New players don't understand how to value stats and skills. Heck, probably half of the resident players don't understand how to estimate power based on stats.

    As for the Train/Optional/Ignore tiers being up to player opinion, I disagree. Capsules are Train tier (at least one each), remedies are Train tier (except Jaguna), top attackers and semi-unique strong skills are Train tier. Anything that isn't one of the highest damagers of its type and doesn't have strong/unique party utility (e.g. O'pari doesn't, U'nasag doesn't) is Optional tier or below. And Ignore tier is Jaguna.

    Even if it's up to opinion, unless you're arguing that opinion varies strongly past the "obvious to new players" part, it's still going to be a useful resource.

    Here's a quick rundown (without much in explanations) (hindsight: oops). You're going to see a lot of "Use" and "Train" for SS/S. That's alright, since most players won't have most of them, and (more importantly) there should be a section explaining in more detail how to build a team.

    SS:
    - Ami'sandra: Use (mediocre Healer)/Train (E:Lamia)
    - Amimari: Use (mediocre Healer)/Optional
    - Amina: Use (mediocre Healer)/Optional
    - Bajanna: Use (strong Spear)/Train (E:Valkyrie)
    - Camellia: Use/Optional (conditionally strong Spear)
    - Czekras: Use/Optional (strong Ice)
    - Gaiga: Train (E:Lamia)/Optional
    - Gugba: Top
    - Jennish: Top (Lightning; capsule: anti-Darkness)
    - Koko: Use (strong Fire)/Train (capsule: anti-ice)
    - Lewto: Top (Fire; capsule: anti-Ice)
    - Olber: Use/Train (capsule: anti-physical; Unique: takes damage for allies)
    - Piz'fer: Top (Ice; capsule: anti-Fire)
    - Rikken: Use (Bow) + Train (Pro Negotiator)
    - Samatha: Use (strong Lightning)/Train (Negotiator)
    - Sheena: Use (Sword)/Train (strong level-capped Physical co-op)
    - Suoh: Use (strong Physical)/Train (E: Valkyrie)
    - Yukken: Use+Train (Pro Negotiator)
    - Zerro: Top (Darkness; capsule: anti-Lightning)

    S:
    - Alika: Train (+Item passive)
    - Bonna: Train (Paralysis and Petrify master; +XP passive; E:Chaos)
    - Djugan: Train (top Spear supporter; E:Valkyrie3)
    - Ellvern: Use (Levitate)/Train (Poison master; E:Lamia)
    - Gatz: Use (Levitate)/Train (+Item passive)
    - Gegonago: Top Use (Levitate)/Train (insane Control Time+3 All) Top
    - Lunaken: Train/Optional (+Evasion buff; Spear; good against E:Valkyrie3)
    - Lunato: Train/Optional (+Evasion buff; Bow)
    - Palpa: Optional
    - Pupropu: Use (Lightning)/Train (anti-dark capsule)
    - Puprope: Use (Darkness)/Train (anti-lightning capsule)
    - Pupru: Optional (Bow)
    - Rejin: Optional (Sword; Sleep/Paralyze caster)
    - Sha'plar: Use (Darkness)/Optional
    - Zafitte: Use (Levitate)/Train (Poison/Bomb master; E:Lamia)
    - Zeera: Use (Heal All)/Train (Petrify/Demoralize master; +Money passive)
    - Zuzu: Use (strong Sword)/Train (strong level-capped attacker)

    A:
    - A'merpact: Use (Ice)/Train (anti-fire)
    - Burbaba: Ignore
    - Daiana: Use (Fire)/Train (anti-ice)
    - Eileen: Use (Levitation)/Train (Sleep master)
    - Ka'pori: Train (top Sword support)
    - Kana: Use (Heal All)/Train (Confusion/Paralyze master; E:Chaos)
    - Kem/Korin/Pahrl: Use (Spear/Sword/Bow respectively)/Train (support for their weapon)
    - Metupi/Nakupi/Samupi: Use (for their weapon)/Optional/Train (future?: ultimate <X> killer)
    - Manmer: Train (top Bow support)
    - Maralme: Optional/Ignore
    - R'zonand: Use (Heal All)/Train (Confusion/Sleep master)
    - S'naip: Use (top Bow)/Train (B:Odin, top tier)
    - Velraine: Optional/Ignore

    B:
    - Amazora: Optional (Fire)
    - Ba'gunar: Train (anti-Darkness capsule)
    - Bahl: Use (very strong Sword)/Train (E:Artemis, top tier)
    - Gigojago: Train (anti-Fire capsule; very decent Ice when fully leveled)
    - Grace: Use (Bow)/Train (ultimate Dragon Killer)
    - Jaguna: Cry.
    - Kuscah or Sorman: Use (top healer)
    - Ma'curi: Use (top Spear)/Train (E:Valkyrie, top tier)
    - O'pari: Optional (Fire)
    - Sh'berdan/Zan: Optional
    - U'nasag: Optional (Ice)
    - Zenzoze: Train (anti-Lightning capsule; very decent Darkness)
     
    iscary, Pandemon, Joe and 1 other person like this.
  19. Vintt

    Vintt Active Member

    Messages:
    128
    Likes Received:
    42
    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    what about an optimized List for different scenarios,

    like parties for sword/bow/spear
    then parties for dark/lightning/ice/fire
    after that parties for utility/wards/buffs/debuffs

    then the player can seek the optimization for their parties on a given scenerio
     
  20. HunterScarX

    HunterScarX Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    5
    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2014
    How about none of it lol. Isn't it easier to just ask on the forum?
     
    Tealius likes this.

Share This Page